LJ Idol - Topic 1 - Empty Gestures

[aggienaut]

"My friend!! Where are you from?" the swarthy man in a suit standing outside the Hagia Sophia greeted us with an expansive gesture and even more expansive grin.
   I automatically looked at the ground and kept walking, as did my friends Aaron and Amalie, but next thing I know Mark is talking to him.
   We stand around awkwardly for a moment waiting for Mark to extricate himself but he only sinks deeper in trying to explain to the man why he doesn't want to partake of his "Turkish hospitality!" and go with him to his rug store where there'll be "no pressure!" and ":D"

   I wander across the square and take some photos of the nearby Blue Mosque. I come back and the man has switched to acting deeply offended by Mark's refusal of his "hospitality," while Mark desperately tries to dig himself out of a hole he doesn't seem to realize will inevitably get deeper.
   Conveniently my shoe needs to be tied to I attend to that in front of them, which brings attention to my combat boots, something I was hoping would maybe intimidate the smarmy businessman a little at least.

"Oh you are a soldier! Where from!" the man's reaction is immediate and pronounced.

"Oh no, he just wears those because they're utilitarian" quickly explains Mark.

::FACEPALM!::

   Finally we somehow manage to extract Mark from the conversation and make our escape. Even then he comments on feeling guilty over disappointing the friendly man. Silly, silly, lad.

   One must constantly avoid eye contact with shopkeepers here, and avoid responding to anyone that comes up to you peddling wares, lest they will mercilessly attempt to inveigle their trinkets upon you. (If asked anything in English and for some reason not in a position to ignore them completely, my trick is to respond with "jag prata inte engelska!")

   But this got me thinking, why is it that the streets here and many other places are so rife with scammers and pickpockets trying to empty your pockets with their devious gestures, but the United States seems completely devoid of this villiany? Don't get me wrong I've encountered every trıck nı the book at SOME poınt ın the US, but not at the rıfe and ın your face levels ıt ıs here. EVEN ın downtown Hollywood or Vegas.
   All I could come up with is that perhaps it's the much maligned gun culture -- keep that kind of shenanigans up anywhere in the United States, even if you try to only target tourists, and eventually you'll annoy someone who will blow you away. Or at least punch you in the face.


Related Picture of the Day

Blue Mosque, Istanbul

Not the best picture but it is the specific picture I took in the middle of the above incident (which occured this past Frday)

Comments

[stormkitty.livejournal.com]

Beautiful pic!

And maybe not to the same degree, but it does happen here in the states. The worst for me is walking in the mall. The people working at the little kiosks in the center of the mall are horrible lately. They've taken to stepping in your path to get your attention. I've also seen it bad in beach areas at night.

Have a fabulous trip!

[fsk8ing-judge.livejournal.com]

I agree with you 100% about the malls. I am sick to death of people getting right up in my face, asking if they can "ask me a few questions", or, my least favorite, "may I see your hands?" (promoting a skin care line from Israel).

[ayoub.livejournal.com]

:D

Well, we have less of the scammers over here, and there's no gun culture...

But, an intriguing question!

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I simplified it a bit in the entry because you know y ou can't qualify everything in a writing contest situation.

But I recall for example not noticing it at all when I was in Sweden, and they don't run around with guns. And I'm sure it does happen to some degree in touristy parts of the united states, and I'm sure I'll get comments pointing out that you'll get punched for being an asshat in many countries...

[beautyofgrey.livejournal.com]

It's not just gun culture - I think it's the fact that much of that scamming and conniving has been legalized through the advertisement and marketing industry in the name of the mighty economy. Instead of being harassed in the streets, we're bombarded with images on billboards, television ads, radio ads, music, shop signs, etc. Sadly, we basically have to pay/donate to the non-advertising public options to escape such marketing/harassment.

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

Indeed! I was reading something about the Yahoo company that mentioned that internet companies like that make the overwhelming majority of their money from advertising and all the services they provide are really just for one thing, exposing people to their ads. And that got me thinking how they recently completely deflated the paying accounts of flickr (which they'd recently come into possession of), presumably because they'd rather get our money by exposing us to ads than giving us ad-free paid status. I personally would much rather pay not to see ads though.

[roina-arwen.livejournal.com]

I hate those strong-arming street tactics. Great photo, by the way! :)

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

Thanks (:

[foxdiva9.livejournal.com]

Ohhh pretty..

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

Thanks (:

[alephz.livejournal.com]

Wait.

The US has no pickpockets or scammers? No sales pressure? No places that want to take advantage of tourists unaware of local customs/dangers?

Man, I dunno 'bout that. I've been to Las Vegas more'n once.

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

I'd imagine you can get pickpocketed maybe in new york city and very occasionally anywhere else, but I think it's nothing compared to certain places in the rest of the world -- I've never been to Italy but I've heard the pickpockets are REALLY bad there.

[teaberryblue.livejournal.com]

I am really surprised to hear anyone say that scammers and pickpocketing don't exist in the United States! I see it all the time...on a weekly, if not daily basis, just walking down the streets of tourist areas where I live.

I think it's also a bit off to call people villains just because their way of selling their wares is not the same way American shopkeepers act. That seems like a pretty strongly virulent word for not liking a cultural difference. They're not American; why expect them to act American? Haggling as a vendor isn't a scam. It's a normal way of selling in many parts of the world, and even many parts of the US. Just because you aren't used to it doesn't mean there's anything wrong with it.

(edited typo!)

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

It's not that they're haggling there's nothing wrong with that, its the mind games this guy was playing. Acting offended to guilt Mark into coming with him, being extremely psychologically manipulative. THAT I consider villiany. I have no doubt that if Mark actually did go with him the situation would spin much much further out of mark's control.

[cacophonesque.livejournal.com]

I suspect that it mostly has to do with where you are going in the United States and where you are going when you visit other countries. When I lived in Prague for a few months, I always ran into pickpockets and scammers when I was in Stare Mesto or Nove Mesto, but never really when I was in Zizkov or Vinohrady or out in the panelaky neighborhoods. Likewise, when I'm hanging out in my neighborhood in Brooklyn, I rarely encounter such behavior--but when I find myself having to navigate through Times Square I'm absolutely overwhelmed by it.

Tourists are naturally viewed as great opportunities to make quick money--and easier to deal with, because if you sell them something of poor quality or slightly defective, they're very unlikely to come back and complain to you. And, yes, it happens all the time in the US, too. You just don't notice it, because you're not the one targeted by it.

(edited for a typo)

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

I noticed this most recent visit to Istanbul that I it didn't bother me in the weeks I was out and about in the area but the one time I had to cross Sultanahmet square (ground zero of tourism) with a luggage bag, they were on me like flies!

[impoetry.livejournal.com]

Oh no no, we have it hear as well. Especially if you visit New York City.

An "aspiring music artist" said "here's my CD it's free," and put it directly into my palm. I was caught off guard and he followed up with "what's your name bro" before following up to autographing it to me.

I said "thanks" and he then turned on me.

"Oh come on I signed it, don't you think you should pay now?"

It was crazy and awkward and I had just trying to be nice. That didn't
work out so well for me.

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

Ah yeah, someone tried to do that to me once, actually in the middle of campus where I was going to school at UC Davis. Gave me a "free book" and then asked for a donation. I quickly handed the book back. Then here the other day someone on the street tried to offer me a "free book" about Istanbul but I was hip to his games. I hope you handed the CD back to the "aspiring artist"?

I took a "theories of persuasion" communications class once at uni. This particular trick is called "pre-giving." Give someone something "free" and then they'll feel obligated to give something in return.

[furzicle.livejournal.com]

Mark, Mark, Mark...

[baxaphobia.livejournal.com]

Cultural differences. Your trip must be fascinating! I have to catch up on your LJ!

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

And I have to catch up on comments! ;D

[fsk8ing-judge.livejournal.com]

LOL at the boot story. It could only happen to you . . .

[heethen-crone.livejournal.com]

Yeah, cultural differences. Like .... some places you have to haggle, here in the US, you don't. I suck at it but got semi good when I went to Mexico last.
Beautiful pic.

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

I've decided haggling is only fun if you (a) have a basic idea of the value of the item; and (b) go in with a "I really don't care if I walk away with this or not" attitude. Don't be afraid to low ball them hard. If you have a local friend, scope out the item you want and then have your friend get it for you, it'll be the best, because they see a tourist they're NOT going to get as low as the local price.

Travel Tips

[vakratunda.livejournal.com]

In the old days you could beat them.

Probably still can some places.

I bet you that if you looked one dead in the eye and said 'You are not my friend. Leave before I harm you.' In Turkish (or whatever) he would leave. You'd definitely have to say it like you meant it.

Also it is remarkable how very, very easy it is to bring a handgun across borders, even with the current regulations. It requires a bit of ingenuity, but not very much. You might have to modify a metal-lined attache case in a professional manner, but the skills to do that are skills you want to have anyway.

Great tradecraft, the bit with the combat boots. Too bad about Mark. Brief the civilians next time.

And remember, always keep a fifty dollar bill in your passport. If the cop is honest, he doesn't have to take it. And if he's not, you don't have to offer it.


.

empty gestures

[danialtravieso.livejournal.com]

Oh my Gawd you really are in Turkey???!!!!!

XLNT

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

I was! And then I spent a lot more time there! (:

[http://users.livejournal.com/____hejira/]

Combat boots are useful in that situation. Sad for your friend for not geting the point.

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

Indeed indeed :P

[comedychick.livejournal.com]

Can't be the guns. It's not like that in Australia either, and we don't do the gun thing. And I don't think Australia is the only place where guns are illegal that it doesn't happen.

But I recognise the familiarity in the story. I have seen that behaviour in Europe and around Asia. It's always the same types of folks. I definitely keep my head down and walk past. It's the only way to survive it.

Great story! I liked how you were able to relate the topic with your travels. :)

[mstrobel.livejournal.com]

Oh boy. That is why I often keep my headphones in, even though I have no music playing on my ipod, just to try and avoid being accosted in markest and such places.

(By the way, what's the difference between 'pratar' and 'talar'?)

Swedısh Grammar

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

I'm not actually sure the dıfference, I use them ınterchangeably. (but note I am far from an expert on Swedısh grammar, I'm not a natıve speaker)

[plastrickland23.livejournal.com]

I love the picture.

Your post reminds me of nearly every trip I make to my local shopping mall. All the kiosk vendors out inthe middle between shops, who want you to try their lotions, play with their remote control toys or try their samples of whatever....I feel so hustled and hassled anymore in the mall. I know people are desperate to earn a living and times are bad...but,....Ya think that makes me any more able to spend my money?? I walk in the mall with my eyes down to keep the vendors at bay. P.

[sonarvampress.livejournal.com]

They have them in the US too, they're just a little smarter. At our local tourist trap we get the guys who tell sob stories, they always say they're in the military and their wife cheated on them and they need money for a hotel or a flight home or something. The thing is, it sounds like a good story, if you haven't heard it 10 times so most people don't notice they're there. It's the same with the 'my car broke down and I need gas money' story, how many times have you hear that? Of course they're not everywhere here, and they're probably smarter because they know they'll get in big trouble, but they're out there.

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I've seen those guys, but what we don't have much of ın the states ıs the ones who are AGGRESSIVE aggressıve as ın get ın your face actıng offended you won't travel wıth them to theır shop or somethıng. That,s what I thought was really rıdıculous about guys lıke the one ın thıs story, ıt was far from just a passıve sob story.

[ellistrae.livejournal.com]

LOL reminds me of all of the peddlers in Indonesia trying to sell fake designer pens or perfume or something equally useless. God, those people were persistent. I'm far too nice to deal with those people, luckily my husband had absolutely no problem getting them to go away.

That is a gorgeous picture!

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

In Nairobi recently this guy practically cornered me in his shop trying to sell me something it was almost scary.

[boxsofrain.livejournal.com]

Very true.

Oh hey, you should text me next time you are in NYC like before you are there. :)

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

Well I canit text frmo now UNTIL I get there, but I,ll be there from Nov 7th for about a weekç (:

[bigdoug.livejournal.com]

I actually got the same kind of thing when I went down to a tourist city in Mexico. People trying to sell me stuff and then acting hurt if I was not interested. Pushy as hell.

I think it only happens in places that have a lot of tourists, and only towards people who look LIKE tourists, such as people who look out of place or "American". If you're the only Caucasian in a city of hispanics or middle eastern people, you're gonna stand out like a sore thumb, and the shop owners are going to think "Ahh, stupid American tourist to rip off!"

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

Yeah I've spent a lot more time in Istanbul since this entry, and when I was walking around just going about my business people would leave me alone or even ask me for directions, but the one time I had to walk across Sultanahmet with my luggage bag they were all over me all over again like flies, I wanted to yell "I'm not a tourist!!" at them. lol

[poppetawoppet.livejournal.com]

I've never really seen it anywhere. In the US though we like to call them infomercials. ;)

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

Yeah they just get you when you turn on the TV! Or try to invade your inbox! Or call you on the phone...

[beldar.livejournal.com]

I think the lack of in-your-face peddling (which you can still get in the U.S. at places like around carnys) is something that the gun culture is more a reflection of, that Americans are very much a mind-your-own-business people. For the most part we're individuals doing our individual thing, and throughout our history we've always had that option, often exercised, that when too many people are bugging us, we can always pick up stakes and "move west" where we won't be bothered so much. 200+ years of that kind of attitude is hard to change.

[emo-snal.livejournal.com]

Hmmm indeed indeed